How do I get a taller Artisan loaf

[gsevelle]

Ok, I've tried several different methods of trying to make a free form Artisan loaf. While my flavor has been good on all my loafs I'm not happy with the size and shape. After the second rise they are all puffy in the banntones and then when I turn them out the go flat. I socred and brushed and placed in oven but they only rose to about 3 inches final hight. How do I get the loaf to grow to say 5 inches or so in the center?

[crustyo44]

Hi gsevelle,
You are not the only one with that problem. I resorted to baking in tins but I love to see some answers from experienced bakers to solve this problem.
Even my round loaves always finish up 2 inch thick.
Do you use sourdough starter or yeast?
Regards,
Jan.

[gsevelle]

Hi gsevelle,
You are not the only one with that problem. I resorted to baking in tins but I love to see some answers from experienced bakers to solve this problem.
Even my round loaves always finish up 2 inch thick.
Do you use sourdough starter or yeast?
Regards,
Jan.

I have the same problem with sourdough, yeast and a combination of both. GERRRRRRRRR

[RodinBangkok]

Difficult to pinpoint, but in general a heavy dough..too much flour will inhibit rise, also mentioned above is loaf going flat after proofing, that is most likely over proofing. Watch the dough, not the clock in that case. For new untried formulations I always start with less flour than called for and gradually add till the dough gets to what I feel is the right consistency. In general adding too much flour is a common mistake.

[Snags]

I made a few loaves over the weekend
They seemed a little flat as they where rising on a flat surface and where going E,W,N and South
So I wet my hands gave them a good side slapping and popped them in the oven while they were still up
...it worked

[wheels]

I have the same problem with sourdough, yeast and a combination of both. GERRRRRRRRR

Mmm... You shouldn't get this with yeast unless you're using a very wet dough. What you do need to do though is ensure that you get a tight 'skin' on the dough.

You can see in this video how she keeps turning the dough under, stretching the outer skin. OK she's making rolls, but the principle's the same for all loaves:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TB908K3Kd6k

Sourdoughs another matter, although I make it occasionally I claim not expertise, so I'll leave it to others. Certainly, my experience is that 'free-form' i.e. without a banneton you get a very flat loaf.

Phil

[gsevelle]

Wheels,

I'll give it a try I may need to add more flour to my dough as it is sticky. I did use a banntone this last time. When I turned the round out of it, it went flat on me. That was the whole reason I bought the banntone I thought it would help keep the loaf shape.

I guess this will just be a work in progress.

[wheels]

Sourdough is a lot more fluid that normal yeast doughs - the video was more related to doughs with yeast. Sourdoughs don't rise as high but usually get good 'oven spring'. I've found that once risen they need handling very very gently.

FWIW, here's one I did:

http://www.localfoodheroes.co.uk/?e=685

Comparing my recipe with your's may help.

Phil

[Fatmat]

I know that this is an old post, but I thought I'd add a little anyway.

I am relative newbie and have started playing with higher hydration breads - 80%. I use the stretch and fold technique to help develop the gluten (http://www.fornobravo.com/pizzaquest/instructionals/59-written-recipes/175-the-stretch-and-fold-method.html) . I use the direction of my stretch and folds to pre-shape my loaf - a little like getting the gluten going in the right direction for the shape of your final loaf. If you do three or four rounds of stretch and fold you will feel the gluten getting noticeably tighter. I use the final round of stretching and folding as my final shaping before final proofing.

I have noticed that the longer to do it's final proof, the greater the chance of the dough 'flowing'. This will happen if the dough over proofs and stretches the gluten to 'breaking point'. But I also I think this is partly because the gluten gets to relax too much for the final proof if it is left too long.

Also, the longer I leave the bread to proof overall, the weaker the gluten structure is, possibly because the enzymes and acids from the sourdough starter start breaking down the gluten then the gluten strength is weakened. I think that if I use less starter then this effect is minimised for longer fermentations.

I hope that this makes sense and is useful.

Mat

[Fatmat]

Another detail - lower hydration loaves give more vertical lift and less horizontal spread if you are making free-form loaf. Eg, 65% hydration rate.